Esky Lama Owners Thread

Each helicopter has a sticky thread and any other good threads of that helicopter can be linked to the sticky thread here.

This is the sticky Esky Lama Owners thread. You can discuss and post anything related to Esky Lama helicopter here. You can create new threads to discuss Esky Lama if you want. If you do, please start your thread with the helicopter name like Esky Lama...... so that it is easy for other members to find. Try to name your thread as descriptive as possible and avoid something like I need help or Help.


Links to important information about Esky Lama coaxial helicopter.
HeliTown Esky Lama Owners Organized threads
http://www.helitown.com/EskyLama.htm

[The Broker]

Hi All, :D
This is my Lama 2, I really like the little co-axials because they are just so much fun
Anyone can be hovering in about 15 minutes so they are very user friendly.

There are lots of people who's introduction to heli's came about through these little birds. I know mine did.

Sue

[markdeacon]

Hi,

Here's some pics of my Esky Lama V3.

Got a question....

How deadly are these Li-Po batteries? From some of the videos I have seen on Google video there lethal. I had a quick look on Google for some info and they said there pretty safe as long as you don't discharge them too far and you use a good quality charger.

Now i'm not sure how good quality this Lama V3 charger is and can I trust it not to overcharge the Li-P- battery and burn my house down?

Oh yeah how far should I discharge the battery. I have been discharging it to the stage where it can no longer sustain flight and the LED inside the cockpit is RED.

Its not dead flat tho coz the lights still on and the rotors spin just not quite enough to fly.

[eddiemoth]

Hi markdeacon,

How deadly are these Li-Po batteries? From some of the videos I have seen on Google video there lethal. I had a quick look on Google for some info and they said there pretty safe as long as you don't discharge them too far and you use a good quality charger.

Li-Po is not that bad as it sounds but you need to be careful with it and follow the safety guidlines. I think anybody in RC helicopter uses Li Po batteries.


Now i'm not sure how good quality this Lama V3 charger is and can I trust it not to overcharge the Li-P- battery and burn my house down?
I don't own an Esky Lama but even when you charge it with a good charger, the advice is always charge it outside or in a garage where there is no combustible stuff close by and you should observe it constantly while charging. If you like the hobby and serious about it, it may be a good idea to buy a good charger.

Oh yeah how far should I discharge the battery.
Normally, you don't discharge a li po battery to less than 3 Volt per cell. So if your battery is two cells, then you should not discharge it below 6 volt and 9 volt for a 3 cell, etc. Check here for more the info about a li po battery http://www.helitown.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=117 .I would recommend you have a volt meter or buy a better charger that has a volt metter built in. But you should time your flight and when you begin to feel that your heli needs more juice during flying it is good to land and leave the battery until it is cool down before charging.

How do you like the hobby so far?

Feel free to ask questions
Welcome to HeliTown

[G-MRM]

The basic is....

Only use a good Li-Po charger of the correct settings for the battery being charged. Max charge is 1C, so if the current rating is 800ma (0.8 amp) you only charge at 800ma or less never more.

Only discharge to 3 volts per cell, or only fly until you notice the power dropping off. Soon as you can tell it is not the same, land and recharge.
Don't fly to the bitter end !!

Charge on a fireproof surface in the open if you can or inside BUT NOT UNATTENDED. Keep Li-pos in a metal tin when not in use.

That's the quick guide !!!

[markdeacon]

Cheers for the replies guys! If I charge my Li-Po battery in the garage it's going to be left unattended because i'm not going to be able to sit in there for a hour and a half.

At the moment its just sitting there charging in the corner of my room where if I turn round I can see it.

Some of the stuff on Google makes these things sound like hand grenades!

Next time I charge it I will put it in the garage.

[markdeacon]

Hiya all!

What do you guys think of me flying my Esky V3 Lama?

That's how good I am after 7 batteries. Haven't broke it yet so that's the main thing lol.

http://video.google.co.uk/videoplay?docid=3129972915038725769

Cheers all!

Mark Deacon

[eddiemoth]

Mark, that is pretty good! It looks every stable. I wonder how could whoever on the sofar not even look at the helicopter! You did a nose in hover!

[markdeacon]

lol whats a nose in hover?

I need to know all the names for that kinda thing.

[eddiemoth]

Hi Mark,
If you fly a single rotor heli like Blade CP, Trex 450, etc., you'll know doing a nose in hover is an advanced - not beginner skill. The beginner pilot starts with tail in hover first meaning you always keep the tail of the heli pointing to you - (you stand behind it) all the time. This is easy because when you move the aileron stick to the right, the heli move the right and when you move the same stick to the left, the heli move to the left. When you do a nose in hover (the nose of the heli facing you), the control of the aileron stick is reversed. You will need to control your heli like you are in the heli cockpit. Switching the control from tail in to nose in and back and forth during flying is challenging for benginner pilots with a signle rotor helis because they are fast and twitchy. If you don't react quick enough, one wrong move of your stick means.........crashing heli to the ground. With a multi-rotor you can do it easily because it is very stable and slow. Try to test your control yourself, you'll know that it is different when you hover tail in and nose in. That is a good question.

[markdeacon]

I had my first ever flight outside with my lama today! was good had it going all over the place to start with but i started to gain control after a while out there.

Had it hovering pretty still at about 7-8ft the highest i have ever had it. Ive never had it over head height in the past and seen the battery from underneath during flight before. But it was getting dark and i couldn't see properly so I had to use the it inside after it charged again.

When i was flying it inside today i adjusted the linkages so it needs virtually 0 trim to hover pretty steady. It drifts from left to right and forward and back slightly but its easy to correct.

Can't wait to fly it again tomorrow. It will be its 10th full battery.

[eddiemoth]

Mark,
I am glad that you are having fun and that is what the RC heli hobby all about! You sounded it like you are completely in now. Warning - not easy to get sober from heli addition. When flying outside, just watch out for unexpected winds. Esky Lama is too small and light to handle winds.

[markdeacon]

lol yeah I know. at one point outside i was giving it full power left turn to just keep it steady lol. That's when a breeze got it but it was still controllable.

[forenzik]

hi guys,

need some help from all of you who own an esky lama, for my final year project at university!

my uni budget doesnt allow me to buy a lama, so i need some info from you lot. if you can please respond and tell me any of this info:

Main blade airfoil type
Main blade twist
rpm of the main blade
size of the motors
rpm of motors in hover
gear ratio of the gearing between the motors and the main blades

i would be very grateful for this info,

thanks!!!

I got the motor size for you: 340mm. I am sure others would help you with the rest of the info. Good luck with your project in school.

[janikphoto]

OK, so I read the thread about using the brown packing tape on the rotors to help protect them in a crash. I used black photo tape, and it works well too. Plus, it is bllack, so it is hidden better. I assume almost ANY tape would help on the blades. So far my blades are holding up a lot better than the unprotected ones...

[G-MRM]

Boy I wish that would work on my 50 size nitros, save some money !!

Glad it works, i have not read that before, what type of blades are they?

Martin

[swatson144]

I'm now nearing 3 hrs in this class so I feel I can speak to it a little.

1, out of the box it flew OK but tracking was off on the top blades so I twisted them as it seemed to indicate in the "one size fits all" instruction pamplet. Tracking would be fine for the next few mins but let it sit while charging and back to the fiddlethon of twisting blades for 1/4 pack. I found that adjusting the link from the flybar to the top blade holder is a much better way. No idea if it's the right way or not but seems to cause no ill effects.

2, The blades seem very durable. I caused an in flight boom strike by seeing how fast I could get it to go and pulled back too hard. It landed with the grace of a shot duck. No damage other than a couple minor dings. I doubt I'll reinforce the blades. Certainly not a machine to throw around though, nice smooth flying seems to be it's design parameters.

3, I thought I'd be bored with it in a few mins. No consideration was given to the plethora of ways to fly to make it destabilized. Moving around in GE and cruising over an elevated object adds to the challenge, especially nose in. Don't be afraid you'll be bored!

4, bad trim and setup is pretty much disguised by the stability of this little beast. It seems to me that the centrifugal stabilizing bar (flybar) is constantly correcting the attitude. So if you have a little say forward and left on the swash it pretty much stays in place with only a slight propensity to travel forward and left certainly no tendancy to continue to accelerate in that direction like a non coaxial. So I thought it was well trimmed but on watching it I could detect a "jimmy" (almost a vibe type rattling/ fast bobbing). Trimming it properly made a big difference and it'd hover smoothly with only a random tendency to be moved along with air currents. In effect it literally fights control input wether unintentional or desired. So you really want it to only see intentional control inputs. I'm not real big on trimming my other helis so this was a big surprise.

5, flat turns only no matter how hard I try I can't get a banked turn out of it. It's ok though just need to keep flying other helis to keep inpractise which was always the intention any way.

All in all it's a wonderfull little heli and if you don't yet have one you should soon!

Steve

[swatson144]

I broke one of the the little useless fins off my Lama boom and used "plastruct" plastic weld on it. It did a fine job, and I can't tell which one broke. It is also possible to hold the heli up with either so i think it good stuff. I already had a bottle or else I'd have just cut the other off. :lol: I'd expect it'd work fine for glueing the hole thing back together if needed about 4$ for 2 Fl OZ. Also great for assembling styrene canopies.

Steve

[Sleepstalker]

Steve it sounds like you are a kid in a candy store with this little heli !.. 8) That's what it's all about < havin' fun and being inventive... :D

[swatson144]

You got that right! Of course it don't hurt that it's so windy outside the last week you can't sit a heli on the ground with out it blowing over. :wink: This has been a horrible spring. I'm enjoying the little heli but I can't wait to get the bigger ones in the air again.

Steve

[redlof]

Hi guys !
New Lama V4 owner checking in. Bought my lama V4 couple weeks ago. broke my stock blade after a couple of crash. then i bought a few pairs of extreme blades, inner alu shaft, bottom bearing housing, dynam vortex flybar and 7.4 850 15c lipo. after installing those parts and lots of triming now my V4can hover handsfree. But i got one problem with the new lipo (premium power 850 15C) it only gave me 5 min fly time and my stock lipo can go more than 9 min. Did i got a bad one or the premium power is a crap lipo ? Anyone try the premium power lipo before ?

[eddiemoth]

Hi redlof,
After upgrading do you know how much weight you put on your heli. If you get it trimmed to point that you can hover handfree, the chance of your short flight may be the extra weight your heli get from the alum upgrades.

[redlof]

Hi, Eddiemoth
I think the weight did not do much different cos my with my stock lipo is gaving me same flight time before and after upgrade.

[basic]

how many packs have you flown through the new battery? sometimes you need to "break in" new lipos by flying them through about 1/2 at about 1/2 the rated flow for the first 5 flights or so and allowing them to fully charge in between. i usually discharge the packs to 1/2 power by just hovering them and then do a slower (less than 1c) charge on them. in the case of a 850mah battery, i would probably charge at 500mah or something just to get a good charge in it.

Alternatively, if you have access to one of these -http://www.cadex.com/prod_analyzers/overview.asp

or a good lipo charger you can set it up to do the charge/discharge cycles on it's own.

also, never charge batteries while they are still warm right after a flight, let them cool for a bit first. it helps. I'm sure others will have pointers there.

It may be that the batteries are dropping below the LVC on the esc before time, or it may be that they need broken in, or it may be those batteries just can't do what they are rated of. without a in flight monitoring system, or a bench test that you can replicate the loads on a bench with test equipment it's hard to tell.

[redlof]

Hi, Basic
Thanks for the info, have flown 8 packs on it and i also notice that it's warmer than my stock lipo with just 5 min fly time and i always charge my lipo after 30 mins or more after each use. I'll try a better charger on it later and see how's the result.

[redlof]

Lama V4 with extreme bx2 canopy and boomtown's skid & tail boom
http://img34.picoodle.com/img/img34/9/9/7/f_PICT1915m_64e93d7.jpg
http://img34.picoodle.com/img/img34/9/9/7/f_PICT1918m_f14226b.jpg

[eddiemoth]

Ken,
Thanks for sharing the pictures of your Lama V4. It looks big. With that canopy, it looks like Trex Lama. :)

[redlof]

Hi, Eddiemoth
Yeap the canopy is bigger than the stock lama's canopy and it did make my lama bigger lol . The tail mode did make the heli looks more sporty and it did fly better in tiny breeze and also more easy for me to put/remove the lipo.

[eddiemoth]

I took my son's Esky Lama V3 to the backyard this morning. Just want to share a few picture with other Lama owners. The vertical fins were already broken off. :)

http://www.rchelicoptertown.com/forum/photoplog/file.php?n=251&w=l

http://www.rchelicoptertown.com/forum/photoplog/file.php?n=250&w=l

http://www.rchelicoptertown.com/forum/photoplog/file.php?n=249&w=l

http://www.rchelicoptertown.com/forum/photoplog/file.php?n=248&w=l

[redlof]

Wow ! I see u fly outdoor and great scenary u had.
Nice Pic.

[xodarap1]

Hello Everyone! :-)

I'm brand new to the forum and i'm ready to purchase my first RC heli (Esky coaxial) - would much rather spend a few dollars on Lama repairs as opposed to hundreds or more on a larger single rotor heli). I'm not new to RC modeling though. I've built a glider, planes and even a prop driven, lowered, wide stance nitro corvette with monster truck tires that cruised at 45mph lol.

I've read through a lot of pages here and other websites but still have a few more questions. I really want to be sure I get a great deal on the needed mod parts for more speed/power and the most bang for my buck, without buying parts that are simply eye candy or won't usually break etc. I understand that it is impossible to have the best of both worlds, but i'm trying lol. I'm looking to buy a new v3 or v4 with some nice high performance mods and 2 extra batteries. Can that be done for around $250 to $300? What I don't know are what parts to get and what parts to skip. I'm not concerned with the look of the heli, just performance so that flying outdoors in some light to moderate wind would be possible so i won't be house bound with it. I've seen videos of modded v3's so i know it's possible to do. The videos i watched were:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tpPTVY4H5ms&mode=related&search=
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gc2QBIoyDUs
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IpNj_dlA6g4

So far, I've priced for the heli and upgrade parts at:

raidentech.com/4rche.html
raidentech.com/bles4colav4r.html
rchelicoptershop.com/catalog/
miracle-mart.com/store/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=1126
miracle-mart.com/store/index.php?main_page=news_article&article_id=18
slickzero.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=CTGY&Category_Code=Upgrades
slickzero.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=CTGY&Category_Code=LamaP

I have no idea where the best place to buy is. I don't want to get ripped off and value the advice of you folks here in the forum instead of the dealers that might just want to sell everything to me.

1. Besides the look, what is the difference between the Esky Lama v3 and the v4?

2. Can both be modded up to the same level of performance?

3. What is the range of the controller/heli and will that be an issue when flying outdoors?

4. I've heard of blade clash on the Esky Lama's. Would the upgraded parts solve that problem or make it worse?

5. Eventually i do plan to move to a single rotor electric heli. I'm used to left throttle controllers from my plane and car days. Should i continue with the left throttle controlled Esky or would that create problems for me later on when i move to a single rotor heli? My best guess is that the single rotor heli can be made to be either left or right throttle so it would be a non-issue, correct?

6. Do the better battery packs overheat the motor if used for two or three flight sessions back to back?

7. Are any of the frequencies better than others (as far as interference or range)?

That's it. I'd appreciate any advice, suggestions that would help with my purchase.

*I'm sorry that my first post was so long. I promise to keep thing shorter from now on. ;)

I'm glad to be here. Thanks in advance.

Steve :)

[swatson144]

Welcome to HeliTown xodarap1 (http://www.rchelicoptertown.com/forum/member.php?u=1196), IMO you are making a little bit much of the mods and such on the coaxial. No doubt some improvement can be made but nothing really drastic. Remember that the heli was designed to be stable and easy to fly (and hits bang on the mark) . Anything you do from there makes it less stable and less easy to fly. IMO buy one and start saving for a single rotor from there. I base that opinion on a couple points. It's hard to fly an coaxial in the wind by the time you can do it you won't want to (unless you are selling mod parts) and given a choice you'd be on a single rotor flying. They can't make coordinated turns you'll soon be wanting that. They would be a wonderful 1st heli but IMO avoid investing in bling and put the money towards a good RTF single like the HB King etc as 100$ in bling would go a long way toward having it in hand. I mention this as I have several helis and the Lama I think was bought about #7 to #9.

Flying an FP in the wind takes much more than the beginner skill level. Instinct is to cut the throttle when the wind lofts it. The proper action is to lower the nose and turn altitude into airspeed. Cutting the throttle don't work so good.

Range? most people never unwind the antenna. I'd say it'll control as far as you can determine the orientation if you do good range checks first.

Mode 2 (left hand throttle sticK) is what we fly in the US.

Freq on 72mhz is good. You really won't know about a particular chan until you try it. Odds are very good it is all the same. After all the FCC gave us those channels exclusively. Crystal sets are available to change.

I usually only fly mine in 5 min flights. The motors get hot and since I don't want to buy 20$ worth of motors prematurely I let them cool. 2 flights per pack and they last a long time too.

My advice is buy it, fly it, enjoy it. I see too many people with a ton of money in the 1st heli that they never fly after getting the 2nd one. In this case the lama would likely just get flown around inside in inclement days, and having a bunch of performance mods for that would be counter productive.

Steve

[xodarap1]

Hi Steve!

Thank you so much for the advice. I appreciate your taking the time to respond. I don't have a lot of cash to spend.. was only looking to save on shipping by getting the common and upgraded parts at one shot instead of ordering stuff as it breaks or if i would want to upgrade some parts down the road. I had no idea that the mods didn't do that much to up the performance or justify the expense. I do understand what you are saying and that makes total sense to me now. Thanks again.

Steve :)

[Lardfly]

I got a coax for indoors. This was a blue Lama V4 but I noticed how tight the fuse fits and how hot the motors got. I swapped out the stock fuse for this contraption. The weight for this stuff was 11 grams more than the stock Lama but cooling is much better now. Kind of different and am happy to drop the kinda ugly fuse and those spindly skid thingies. Still flys great and having a blast table hopping around the house. BCP canopy, J-Team skids(shortened), hacked rear frame and boom of BCP and Super skid tail parts..all just odds and ends laying around the shop. Will likely finish burgandy with gold trim.

[eddiemoth]

Looks great. Do you fly it with your Futaba 9C?

[Lardfly]

Looks great. Do you fly it with your Futaba 9C?

Sure enough! 9C in plank mode.

[eddiemoth]

How did you mod the 4 in 1?

[swatson144]

Don't need no mods Eddie. I've been using the 9c with my V3 since I got back from SEFF with it, eventually installed a Futaba short can crystal so it is on the same Freq as most my other helis. I'm using SW1 in heli mode which is nice because having flatter throttle curves allows it to be a little more manageable around hover.

The CX2 has the 2.4g which is it's claim to fame and it's downfall to me.

Steve

[eddiemoth]

Wow, that is easy. I see my son's V3 collecting dusts on the table. I check to see if I can get it to work with my Futaba 9C. Thanks for the info.

[swatson144]

Mine is setup this way
SWH1
chans 1,3,and 4 are reversed.
TC 0, 35, 50, 65, 100% to smooth out the hover.
PC don't matter.
No revo no nothing just straight simple.

Steve

[basic]

eddie - don't know if you ever got you v3 working with the 9c, but i have mine working on my hitec eclipse 7 - standard plank mode with elev, aileron, and rudder reversed. going to try to set it up in heli mode to get the TC and PC.

[cmktech]

Just wanted to say I am a proud owner of an E Sky Lama v4, but am having trouble trimming it.

What is the best way to start the trimming while in the air.

I am scared to get it up in the air 2-3 feet high because it needs so much trimming and I am a beginner.

What's the best way to safely trim it. If it goes 2-3 ft. high it starts going all over the place and it's all I can do to control it back down to the ground. I am so consumed controlling it that I can't even trim it.

[swatson144]

Yous new guys and trimming.:razz:

There is no trimming needed until you can tell what needs trimming. When you can hover steady and realize that you have to hold a little left ails, and a little up elevator then you should trim that out. Over and over I see and hear beginners so worried about "trimming" that trying to fly is just a fiddle-thon. A big part of this is learning how the heli reacts. If you keep moving the trims it reacts differently each time.

I say leave trims the heck alone and get on with it;) until you can hover you probably should only deal with trimming the rudder so it stays TI easier. Just leave the rest alone and fly the sticks.

Steve

[cmktech]

Yous new guys and trimming.:razz:

There is no trimming needed until you can tell what needs trimming. When you can hover steady and realize that you have to hold a little left ails, and a little up elevator then you should trim that out. Over and over I see and hear beginners so worried about "trimming" that trying to fly is just a fiddle-thon. A big part of this is learning how the heli reacts. If you keep moving the trims it reacts differently each time.

I say leave trims the heck alone and get on with it;) until you can hover you probably should only deal with trimming the rudder so it stays TI easier. Just leave the rest alone and fly the sticks.

Steve

Best advice I have heard so far.

Thanks. I am going to leave everything default and do some flying!

I will post a video tomorrow hopefully.

[swatson144]

Outstanding! I'm glad you took that as intended. Good luck and the Helitown virtual funfly (http://www.rchelicoptertown.com/forum/showthread.php?t=909&page=14) needs more vids always.

Steve

[cmktech]

Thanks for the link, I will definitely be posting lots of videos.

Just got a Panasonic SDR-H18 Videocamera for xmas. Plenty of excuses to use it now :).

Going flying tomorrow out front on the driveway if the weather is CALM.

http://www.bsas-digital.com.ar/h18/principal.jpg

[swatson144]

So really how does jealousy look on me?

Nice you musta been a good boy all year.

Steve

[cmktech]

So really how does jealousy look on me?

Nice you musta been a good boy all year.

Steve

I have the nice videocamera but you have the nice helis and the skills to fly them.

I am the jealous one!

[Griffin]

A bit off the topic but why did you choose a Panasonic? I am looking at video cameras at the moment and I am a bit overwhelmed by the number of different makes and models available.

[cmktech]

A bit off the topic but why did you choose a Panasonic? I am looking at video cameras at the moment and I am a bit overwhelmed by the number of different makes and models available.

The value and quality cannot be beat. It offers more optical zoom than others in the price range, as well as a 2.7" screen over 2.5. Hard drive videocameras are great, and after doing my research, I am very happy with this camera.

I could go into more detail if you like.

[Griffin]

The specs are excellent and you get a lot of videocamera for your $$. I was just a bit wary of buying a camera from a company that is not traditionally a camera manufacture.

[Griffin]

I stripped some teeth on my Main Gear A (the one that drives the top rotor and flybar) The only hobby shop that was open today was out of Esky gears but we found an E-flight "Inner Shaft Main Gear:BCX" part number EFLH1243 that is identical to the Esky gear. Same diameter, number of teeth everything. The molding is a bit rougher than the Esky, and it came out of a different mold, but it works perfectly. Is there a connection between the two companies? Are there any other parts that are interchangeable?

[cmktech]

I stripped some teeth on my Main Gear A (the one that drives the top rotor and flybar) The only hobby shop that was open today was out of Esky gears but we found an E-flight "Inner Shaft Main Gear:BCX" part number EFLH1243 that is identical to the Esky gear. Same diameter, number of teeth everything. The molding is a bit rougher than the Esky, and it came out of a different mold, but it works perfectly. Is there a connection between the two companies? Are there any other parts that are interchangeable?

Glad to know those parts will work on the eskys. Only one LHS carries esky parts (where I bought lama v4 from) so its good to know I can use some eflite parts if I have to. Seems every hobby shop carries a lot of eflite parts.

I don't believe there is any relationship between the companies.

Esky is part of TWF hobbies.

www.twf-sz.com

[swatson144]

There was a relationship but it's gotten very discreet if there still is.

The Eflite blade was a rebadged Esky Honey Bee CP. Eflite release it as the blade for a higher price and Esky released the CP2 with Lipo and bell hiller. Soon eflite offered the bell hiller as an upgrade. Later all that horizon would say about it is that, the blade and the Esky product are no longer made in the same factory.

Steve

[G-MRM]

Steve, I never looked 100% at Brokers Lama after her last crash, my eyes just found blades, skids and tail section.

I got the new blades and skid set only to find on the test flight about 2 or so teeth missing on the B drive gear!! Sue could still fly it and remarked the noise made it sound real !!! I have the new gear whell now and it will be fitted soon !!

Martin

[Griffin]

Do all the Lama's motors run hot? I measured my Lama 4 motor after a 10min flight and the surface temperature, on the brush side, was 73 degrees C (that is 163 degrees F). I would guess that the temperature inside the motor would be a lot hotter. The reason I ask is that I have had one motor fail on me. When I opened it up the two of the three commutator strips (where the brushes make contact with the rotor) had broken free. The strips are held in place by a plastic moulding and I am worried that it may have softened due to the heat. (I will post a picture if any one is interested)

The motor failed at the end of the flight. I landed and then a minute or so later tried to take off and the top rotor stopped turning. What I noticed when I took the temperature measurement is that the temperature rises for a about 30 seconds after the motor stops and then starts cooling. I would guess that the down draft from the rotor keeps the outside cool and the temp at the brush side raise when the cooling is removed.

I now let the motor cool down for 30 minutes before flying again.

Has anyone had a similar problem with their motors?

[G-MRM]

I never tested the Lama motors after a flight ! It is a year old now and still the same motors. It is not mine, it's the wifes and it tends to fly for short times not 10 min flat out.

I have a twin rotor bell 47g but I did buy the motor heat sinks from day one. That is 2 years old and still the same motors.

I have bought Steve's Lama 3, it is 'on it's way' over to the Uk so i will do some test on that soon...lol

Martin

[swatson144]

I always just flew for 1/2 a pack and then unplugged and let it cool. I got pretty bored in 5 mins anyway. Brushed motors don't last very long when overheated. After 5 mins they landed warm.

Steve

[G-MRM]

Same here Steve, Sue sets it down to have a chat !!

The most flight time in one go my Bell got was with the nose in training !

Martin

[eddiemoth]

I never measure them but I know they are very hot if you fly for awhile. Like Steve, I stop in the middle of the flight to let the motors cool down.

[Griffin]

I have just passed my 20 hours flying time on the Lama 4. I bought the heli on 1st November so I have been flying for a total of 40 days.
During that time I have replaced:

22 Blade B (bottom blade)
16 Blade A
Gear A (bent the shaft - I later straightened the shaft and re-installed it when I stripped teeth on the new gear )
Gear B (stripped teeth)
Motor B (died after 9 hours)
Both skids (original skids were broken and repaired in 3 places.)
Both canopy and airframe have been repaired a number of times with tape (Heli is now know as Frankenstein)
The Transmitter has used 3 sets of AA batteries (current set is showing two bars)

Total running cost, excluding purchase of Helicopter and extra battery, is R900 ($127) which works out at R22 ($3.19) per hour. Now where else can you have as much fun for $3.19 per hour???

I think it is time for an upgrade :?

[G-MRM]

Wow, that is a good crash log-book you keep !!

I have my Lama V3 now, it's only my second coaxial but my first is still flying two years later and pnly ever changes the blades twice as I remember !

Martin

[joel6912]

i upgraded my v3 with aluminum parts and extreme landing gear and tail, and Im having trouble getting it to hover. It keeps girrating any ideas

[eddiemoth]

I am not familar with the extreme landing gear but do you think it is too heavy?

[saintlazarus]

hi guys,

i have an esky lama which I bought a couple of months ago and already had over 5 hours of flight. I spent at least 4 sets of blades both upper and lower and glued some parts in the boom and the useless tail prop.

My problem is, my last flight ended with a broken motor, resulting apparently from the swasplate moving apart. I purchased two motors of the same type (180) which was not the same brand with those installed originally, but in different photos I saw they do use the brand I purchased.

Now with all the adjustments done, I can't seem to fly my lama since the blades seem to be too slow for even take off. I'm hearing a constant buzz at the same time, and the led on the 4+1 turns red as soon as i start. Some say it is the battery, but I am pretty sure the battery is not dead yet. any suggestions?

thanks

[saintlazarus]

i upgraded my v3 with aluminum parts and extreme landing gear and tail, and Im having trouble getting it to hover. It keeps girrating any ideas

joel, I have the same problem, but maybe your reason is different. Have you checked the bottom to see if the main gears are slightly off track with the motor gears? This was one of my major problems since the shaft may move a bit down if you land hard.

[Griffin]

Is sounds as if the new motors are drawing too much current. I would remove them from the air frame and connect tme directly to the 4in1 and measure the current and do the same with the remaining origonal motor at the same throttle setting.

How did the swash plate moving damage the motor?

[cheeseheads]

I am looking to purchase a Lama V4 on Sunday. Any reason anyone can give me to reconsider this purchase? This will be my first machine and I have no experience, but I will be extreamly patient in my learning curve. Have I made the right choice? I am planning to purchase the basic package with spare parts to include one set of Harden Blades, two sets of extra skids, one extra Inner Shaft, one extra Gear Shaft, one extra Stabilizer and one extra Central Holder. I am holding off on a second battery because of what I have read about motor over heating. If I get one, I'll choose the 900mAh. I am also considering a battery tester. Is that a good idea or will a home digital milliamp/volt meter do the job? This package also comes with a free Simulator disc and cable. What else should I consider? I have really enjoyed the tips I have picked up so far and am really looking forward to starting this new hobby

[eddiemoth]

Hi cheeseheads, congratulation on your decision. I think what important is your patience which you said you have plenty of them so you are ready to go. Lama V4 is a good heli for a newbie looking for an easy heli to start and fly indoor. If you are planning to fly outdoor, you need to reconsider. You seem to cover most of the good parts to have on hand. I am not sure if you need a training gear but it is recommended. My wife could fly her CX2 after two ro three tumbles without a training gear.

[cheeseheads]

Thanks, Eddie. I am planning on flying mostly inside. The wind ALWAYS blows here in southern NM so it takes too long to wait for a good day to fly. I have a small patch of grass that I will fly over on those rare calm days, but not until I'm ready. I'll consider the training gear. Is it generic or machine specific? I am also getting good feedback on the thread regarding on line stores and where I am planning to purchase. I'll let everyone know over there how it turns out. Also the question on gyrocopters just came on a whim. I have a new friend who is trying to convince me to help him build one we can take turns riding in. They are supposed to be the safest type of ultralight aircraft (I know that is not what this site is devoted too, and wont waste a lot of server memory on that), but the one I saw at Wal-Mart was interesting too me. It may be more in the airplane category. BTW the one I saw was $50 so I want to wait a little before I buy. Let's see what comes of that other thread, maybe someone has had some experience. This site is great, I'm having a blast!.

[eddiemoth]

The training gear comes with different size. Yes, ask them for a training gear for Esky Lama. They may just say you don't need it as vendors are happy to see you crashing so you can get more parts from them. :) Not all vendors are like that though. Thanks for saying nice words about the site. We are happy to see you getting into the hobby.

[cheeseheads]

My first flight with my new Lama v4 was, in my opinion, a great success! NO crashes! I was able to hover, even with having to do some significant trimming. That brings me to my questions. I have had to push the elevator trim all the way forward and still my heli wants to pitch backward a little at take off. I can counteract it with the stick and once it is airborn, seems to be alright. Should I try to adjust the control linkage from the servo so I can move the trim lever closer to the center? I see that it is threaded on the end so I assume you pull it off of where it connects to the swashplate and turn it one way or the other and put it back on. If I should do this, how do I know which one, which way to turn it, and how much? I am using training gear that was kind of a pain to put on so I am not sure I got it just right, but the CG seems to be ok. Could that be why it wants to pitch backwards? And if so, should I wait with any adjustments until I get that off? I know it saved my skids already a couple of times, and I am pretty conservative (you know, a belt AND suspenders kind of guy);), so I'll probably keep it on for a while. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

[cheeseheads]

:(Help! On my third pack I had my first crash. Didn't think it was that bad, just looked like I the top off of the Center Hub A had broken. I had a spare, so I put it on while the battery recharged. When I tried to start the heli, first thing I noticed is the lower blades started turning, just a jerk, when I plugged in the battery. Then, when I throttled up, the top blades didn't turn at all. I took the canopy off to make sure everything was free to move and it was. So I had a bright idea. I tried switching the connectors where the motors attach to the 4 in 1. When I hooked the lead for the motor that wasn't turning (top blades) to the other connector, I got nothing. When I connected the motor lead from the motor that was working, (bottom blades) to the other connector on the 4 in 1 I got SMOKE:mad: from the 4 in 1. Now I got nothing. Where do I start? How should I have checked to see if that motor was working or not? Was this just really stupid or what? How do I tell what might still be good and what I have to replace? I am very discouraged at this point especially after such a good start on my first two flights.

[eddiemoth]

cheeseheads, the key word here is the smoke from the 4 in 1. Part of your 4 in 1 was damaged. I would think that your motor is OK. The reason why it was not working might be something else. A motor is less sensitive than a 4 in 1. Where did you buy it from? If it was from a LHS, I would suggest you talk to them to see what they have to say. I would say 4 in 1.

[cheeseheads]

That's part of the problem. This came from the online store, rc711.com, that I thought I was very happy with. Now I'm not sure. How do I test the motors to make sure it is just the 4 in 1? That part alone is $39, but if it and shipping is all I need, then maybe it won't be too bad.

[swatson144]

OK it's likely I'll say some stuff you don't want to hear but....Here's Johnny!

1st I have to assume both rotate freely by hand?

You should make up an adapter to hook 2 AA cells (alkiline in a RS adapter is fine) to the motor connector (as removed from the 4n1). I'm pretty sure they are JST but I don't remember M or Female. JST unshielded male will also fit a servo connector. I'm mentioning this trivia because you probably don't have a room full of plugs and gizmos. Main thing is to test the brushed motors and make sure they aren't shorted and run OK. Luckly you have 2 on the heli and both should behave the same when you compare.

plugging a questionable motor into a 4n1 (or any other ESC) can be costly.

I don't know that the steps you took caused any further damage. More likely the crash stalled a motor and burned the FET out of that ESC. Frnkly a 4n1 with either ESC burn't is no good and no better than one with both burnt. I'm having no Idea though, on why it smoked on changing motors so I'd say both motors need Low Voltage testing to make sure (remove the blades). That setup has no schottky diodes or any thing polarity concentric so plugging in either way should be OK with just caps.

Now for the future... a big part of this hobby is limiting expense when things go a little bit in the sub optimal direction. STOP and think. I often remind me that they haven't outlawed the use of applied reasoning and constructive fore thought. (in your case I'd likely done the same thing) The stakes get worse. A couple months ago I carried a heli across the street and tried to plug in HOLY FRIGGEN SNAP CRACKLE ARC AND POP! I didn't have to unplug anything as the deans connectors melted and didn't plug in. Interesting problem 200$ ESC, 200$ motor, 70$ data logger, either could be the problem. Careful measurement and testing caused no further damage and found the problem. Yep in a rare lucent moment I stopped and ran through a bunch of "what ifs" avoided the ones that were costly used the ones that could only be free...arrived a conclusion.

Steve

[cheeseheads]

Don't know exactly what a "RS adapter" or "JST" mean (just a newb here, remember), and also don't know what an "FET" but that really sound intriguing!. Basically, I think I got the gist. The two motors did rotate freely. So take two AA batteries, I assume in series, and use some wire jumper thingies, plugs, adapters, or what ever I can find, and plug that into the motors (blades off of the shafts) to see if the turn. Direction doesn't matter at this point. I'll let you know, but it looks like either way I need a new 4 in 1. Also understand, don't self medicate, always consult the Dr. first;).

[swatson144]

RS = Radio shack you can get battery holders there. 4 cell AA is handy as you can use it for rx power on the bench and for 2 cells with a jumper. Great for using a real charger on camera bats.

JST = are the 2 pin connectors used for power purposes on the micro RTFs.

FET = field effect transitor. It controls voltage by switching on and off real fast.

Steve

[cheeseheads]

Well it looks like the top motor is bad. It again jerked when I tried to power it up with 2 AA batteries, while the bottom motor turned just fine. So the motor was probalby damaged in the crash which in turn damage the FET in the ESC. Then when I switched the motor leads around, I fried the other one. By the time I replace the 4 in 1 and at least one motor and some more spare parts, I may be better off just getting an entire new heli kit for about $100 delivered. Is it unusual for a stalled motor to fry your ESC?

[swatson144]

It's not at all unusual. A stalled motor can pull many times the current. It can happen on the bigger helis though they usually strip the maingear first.

Steve

[cheeseheads]

It seems like that could be an expensive problem over time. How do I lessen the likelihood of it happening or are there any add on gizmos that can prevent it. I don't remember seeing posts related to this, but I have seen a lot related to broken blades. Was I just unlucky in this crash to have stalled the motor instead of breaking the blades, or do I need to start budgeting more for this hobby if I am going to continue.:doubt:

[swatson144]

on the little helis you can put a fuse into the motor wires. On a lama I'd guess about 4A??? just solder in a tabbed automotive fuse. Unlucky? don't know. If you were off the throttle before crashing you were unlucky. If it did the chicken dance on it's side for a while, then you were just slow.;)

On the bigger ones it's simply a matter of hitting TH in time. A 60A fuse is cumbersome and you may actually hit spikes of 60A on a HV 45A ESC in flight.
Steve

[cheeseheads]

What about the little 3A fuse from Christmas tree lights? I know they are designed for 110V AC, but would they work for this? I am thinking I can mod the fuse block so I could put it in line in both the positive and negative, do it on both motors using 4 fuses, and not add much weight at all. What do you think? Otherwise, which side (positive or negative) do I put this automotive fuse in, and should I just take the time to find a single fuse block and wire that in line so if the fuse pops, I just replace it?

[swatson144]

3A is 3A and higher voltage rating than needed isn't a bad thing. You only need 1 per motor on either wire. 3A may be cutting it close but you could always weight the heli down and run it up to test. If it pops them no big, if not great.

Steve

[cheeseheads]

Thanks, Steve. I'll try it once I have the cash to replace all the fried stuff. I'll let you all know how it turns out.

[Mysterious]

I couldn't resist, I picked off an Esky Lama v4 off Ebay... $100 (including shipping) I'm addicted!

[cheeseheads]

The 3Amp fuse works, Steve. I finally got back to flying. A little drama in our household. My position at work was eliminated after 14 years with the company, so getting the house on the market and job searching has taken up a lot of my time the past few weeks. Has anyone ever placed a job wanted add in the wanted/for sale thread.lol Just kidding, the Lord will provide!;) Anyway, I built a little fuse holder out of a plug end from a set of Christmas tree lights. Wired one lead into each of the two motor leads and power the thing up (after replacing that 4 in 1 and motor I had fried). I powered up and down real hard a few times and actually popped the top blade fuse. May have been a bad fuse because since replacing it, I have not popped another. This seems to be right on the edge for this little heli, so if anyone else is considering fusing their motors to save their electronics in case you stall a motor, I would go a little bigger on the fuses. (Steve actually says that a few posts below). I really like having a fuse holder built in, it makes it really easy to change them out since they are not hard soldered into the line. I'm looking forward to the diversion that flying will provide from job hunting. Keep us in your thoughts and prayers!

[skyranger]

Dear Lama owners,

After abt two days of flying this sweet chopper, I encountered a problem. The lower rotor blade somehow spun much slower than the one above. I took the entire rotor shaft apart to see whether there was a problem with any of the two gear wheels underneath the mainframe. There was none. I reassembled the unit and tried to fly again. The same problem occured. I then studied the chopper closely and noticed that although both the motors sounded allright, the lower rotor blade still turned slower than the one above. Then I noticed that the plastic unit holding the lower rotor assembly did not move together with the outer shaft. The culprit was those two tiny screws that were supposed to hold the rotor assembly to the outer shaft. Bear in mind that these screws must each pass through a hole in the outer shaft, but not too far inside that they touch the inner shaft. But somehow, mine did not fasten strong enough and kept coming out when the lower rotor started to spin. Since all the screws I had than were of similar size to the failed ones, I picked up two longer screws and simply cut them to just slightly longer than the stock screws. Use pliers to cut them. Once these screws were fastened, my V3 flew like a baby. The moral of this episode is, do not rush to your hobby shop everytime the chopper misbehaves. Look closely at it and try to figure out if anything is not functioning as they should.

[Mysterious]

My new Lama 4 seems to turn to the left consistently a little.... a slow rotation.....i can cancel it out by ruddering the opposite way a tad but is there a way to adjust the blades/heli to stop it?

[broggyr]

is there a trim control for the rudder channel? Will look like a small slider under the left control stick. You should be able to null out your rotation with this trim. If this doesn't work, is there some sort of adjustment screw on your receiver?

[Mysterious]

i'll try the trim.... not sure about the screw adjustment

[Mysterious]

had to monkey with the gain & proportional to fix the issue, flies almost perfect straight now

[Mysterious]

grrrrrrrrr...........i monkeyed with gain & proportional...had it flying near straight...was happy w/ the setting........flew off the pack.........went and recharged, went to fly again, and now its turning AGAIN one way!

Everytime after I recharge it starts the turning thing again and I need to re-adjust again.... any ideas why?

[swatson144]

If it's turning slowly and you can easily correct it...don't worry about it IMO. Give it a click or two of trim and keep chooglin'.

You'll be flying the tail forever anyway. With a rate gyro there'll always be creep in hovering and it'll weather vane behind a heli in FF. Later on a heli you install an HH on you'll find it stays locked in one heading, so you have to fly it to keep it behind the heli.

Even with premium gear in rate mode it is very difficult to get revo (proportional) adjusted perfectly and that's with 5 point curves. You can't expect much from the 4n1 but I'm amazed by how well they do.

Steve

[Mysterious]

Yah, its close enough :)

Do I, or should I, be doing any sort of maintenance to my Lama v4? Like does the motor need period cleaning? If yes, how?

[cheeseheads]

I'll be interested in the reply you get to this question. I was wondering the same thing. I am actually taking things a lot slower than you, and guys like barronsroofing. I am walking through all of the ten steps of RADD'S SCHOOL OF ROTARY FLIGHT. It is amazing how much you really pay attention to your heli if you don't cheat this process. I will do it again when I get my first FP or CP heli. I strongly recommend it and since you focus on such a small area to start, you could probably do this now where you live if it is still too cold outside!

[swatson144]

Not much to do to maintain a Lama. The single biggest thing I can think of is only fly for 1/2 a pack as the motors get too hot after that. I'd fly about 1/2 then land and unplug. Go and do something around the house that needed doing then finish the pack. Other than that a good preflight inspection as everything is too hard to get to and so inexpensive to replace later.

Steve

[Mysterious]

Not much to do to maintain a Lama. The single biggest thing I can think of is only fly for 1/2 a pack as the motors get too hot after that. I'd fly about 1/2 then land and unplug. Go and do something around the house that needed doing then finish the pack. Other than that a good preflight inspection as everything is too hard to get to and so inexpensive to replace later.

Steve

Really? I've flown off about 5-6 full packs... you mean I'm likely burning up the motor? Why would that occur?


If I flew outside on a coldr day would that make a difference?

[swatson144]

I know that on the Lama I had the motors would get very hot if run for a full 10 min pack, but if I gave it a break they never got nearly as hot. Heat is the worst enemy to a brushed motor. A cooler running motor will last many times longer. Let's pull some arbitrary numbers out of the hat (they may not be perfect but they'll convey the gist of it). Lets say you can get 50 flights out of the motors at 160F, you'd likely see 150 flights out of the same motors at 140F etc it really makes a huge difference. I'll grant you that I never took a temp on my Lama after a full pack but I thumb checked it and deemed them to be too hot. After about 1/2 pack they were pleasantly warm so I just stopped and let them cool. It don't take long, sip of soda, tote the trash out, etc and go again.

brushed motors are that way because the heat from the brushes needs to be conducted away and as the rest of the motor heats up that don't happen as well. I even found on the micros if I did a little right turn work and then followed it with a cool down period of left turn circuits the motors on the tail lasted much longer (doubt any real impact on a coaxial but perhaps) as an example.

Steve

[Mysterious]

dammnnn, glad you told me... I thougt the other day I smelt "warm metalic" smell ... grrr.... brushless lama time? ;)

thks for the info

[cheeseheads]

Could you even upgrade to brushless motors on a Lama? Don't you have to do many other upgrades as well when you go brushless. Sorry, dumb questions again!:roll:

[Mysterious]

Don't know on that one cheeseheads.....

I was wondering if these would be good replacement motors worth the money when the stock ones burnout...... y/n?

http://www.helidirect.com/product_info.php?products_id=6958

[Mysterious]

Anyone? Everyone just bought stock motors when replacements were needed?

[Griffin]

One of mine died after about 9 hours of flying time (I keep a log book and log flying time, damage, parts replaced, batteries used) I replaced it with a stock motor and it has been running for almost 19 hours. The other stock motor has been running for more than 28 hours of operation. I wold stay with the stock motor.

[Mysterious]

hmmm, ok, good to know

[Mysterious]

Just crashed and broke 2 blades........

what the heck is the difference between

A blades
http://www.helidirect.com/product_info.php?cPath=38_235_265&products_id=619

and

B blades
http://www.helidirect.com/product_info.php?cPath=38_235_265&products_id=620


???????

:?

[swatson144]

Top and bottom.

Steve

[Mysterious]

Top and bottom.

Steve

oh, stupid me, they counter rotate so they are cut as mirror opposites to go the proper direction... d'oh!

lol

[swatson144]

Forrest and trees thing... If Al Gore invented the internet I invented that!

Steve

[Mysterious]

Stupid couch

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nNpItt2dI0s

[Mysterious]

The tail on my Lama is shuddering up and down quite noticeably when I fly it lately....... what could be causing that and how can I fix it?

[swatson144]

That's usually bad tracking.

Steve

[Mysterious]

That's usually bad tracking.

Steve

Blade tracking? On a Lama? Is there such a thing? :confused:

[swatson144]

Yes it covers it in the manual with twisting the blades etc. I found that to be useless information except for the bottom blades.

I found that after the flybar was hurled across the room a few times the single link needed to be adjusted to bring the upper blades in track and the bobbing goes away. it seems the spinning away from the heli tends to change the links length.

Steve

[Mysterious]

hmmmmmm, ok, i'll check it out, thanks!

[Mysterious]

dammit.......... took my lama outside, a big wind gust and me losing orientation slammed it into my house and onto the cement patio...... 3 broken blades and 1 broken landing skid :(

[Griffin]

Try some of these blades. Cost me $10 a set (R75). I am sure you could get them for less but I think they are worth every penny.

I also tied the flybar on with some dacron backing (nylon thread) Saves a lot of crawling around looking for it in my messy house after a crash (not that I ever crash:roll:)

This was one of the few days we could fly outside in Cape Town (sorry about the low quality photo from my mobile phone. The blades are not really bending)

[Mysterious]

They are called "R75"? What are they, a stronger plastic?

Good idea with the flybar tied down

Your lama looks really up there in the air, I'm still nervous getting her too high, how high do you take it? Any wind going or pure calm day only?

[Griffin]

The "R75" is our currency (Rand). The blades are thicker and tougher than the standard blades but seem to have the same amount of lift. They call them "Tupperware" blades here. I dont think the hobby shops like them because they dont break. It was dead calm, very unusual for where I live. I took it up to about 30meters (100ft) before I chickend out!!

If you look carfully you will see that the tail boom has been repaired with tape and the skids, both of them, have been repaired with shrink sleave.

[wez]

Hi everyone, I got a Esky Lama v4 a few days ago which is my 1st heli, and I am having a bit of trouble with it. At 1st it hovered nicely and I managed to get to grips with it quite quickly and could hover pretty well. Yesterday I crashed it quite badly and broke one of the skids and a couple of rotor blades. I glued the skid which seems fine and fitted new rotors. Now though, when I hover, the helicopter keeps doing circles. I keep it pointed straight, but it moves in a horizontal circle, as in left, forward, right, backwards and so on in about a meter diameter, almost like a pendulum weight on a piece of string. I hope I have explained that clearly. I don't know if this has a name, but more importantly, does any one know how to fix it, please. I've adjusted the tracking of the blades best I can and that seems ok.:)

[cheeseheads]

Check to see if the inside bearing on the swashplate is still inside the swash and not poking out and crooked. I have had that happen to me several times after even fairly mild crashes. Let us know how you turn out!

[richbrowne]

Hi. I have just purchased a Lama V3. What are the differences between the V3 and V4 please? I thought the V3 was the latest.:?

Also, I have seen some extreme V3 upgrades. Are these the V3 with the metal upgrades, improved Extreme parts and then with the Sports Canopy and boom added?

Thanks,


Rich.

[swatson144]

Welcome to HeliTown.

I wouldn't worry much about it. They've been wonderful helis since V2. So if you are concerned you are missing anything ....
Perhaps someone who can itemize the differences will speak up.

Extreme and coaxial don't really go together. It is what it is and there are few improvements that are worth anything. I'd say save your money on the upgrades fly it and enjoy, use the money to get another.

Steve

[Mysterious]

My Lama v4 I find has varying trim needs each time I plug it in.... for gain/proportional I've not adjusted it in a long time so thats constant.... but with each new battery it seems the rudder trim needs a lot of adjustment, sometimes I need push it all the way to one side, other times centered is perfect, other just a little adjustment.

Do you guys get that too?

[mtpenguin]

I think that is common in a 2 motor coaxial bird. With voltage variance and temp variance, the gyro / motors have a lot of gray area that can change.

B-)

[Mysterious]

I think that is common in a 2 motor coaxial bird. With voltage variance and temp variance, the gyro / motors have a lot of gray area that can change.

B-)

hmmm, could be, I've actually seen it come back into trim from way out and vica versa.... maybe heat is a factor

[basic]

it could also have something to do with the differences in efficiencies of the two motors, as well as the fact the upper motor has more mass to spin (flybar) which would result in the motor spinning at a different speed as the battery pack gets drained.


EDIT - This was my 500th post..WOO HOO!!

[scifiprime]

hi guys im SCIFIPRIME i have a e-sky doupin first real heli i got one of those 3 channel minis the next day i ordered the doupin i've flown it several times in my small livingroom broke a few blades,i just ordered an all alloy mast and rotor set with a extender turbo shaft that puts the rotors farther apart supposedly makes it faster to respond and so industructable blades.so i'll let you guys know how that turns out as im waiting for clear skys in N.Y.C. it's been raining for several days and im getting ansy,if it wasn't for my simulator i would go nuts. keep your rotors spinning -heli's rule im SCIFI PRIME

[rosetaylor01]

AGGGH.

I feel like a little bit of an idiot.
But I can't work out how to take out the shaft to swap it for the extended one.

Please help

[mtpenguin]

The inner shaft I thought was simply held on by the gear that turns it. Maybe a little stuck?

B-)

[kartinkent]

Thanks a lot in order to advice. I heartily appreciate your taking the time to respond. I don't have a lot of cash to spend.. I was only looking to save on shipping by getting the common and upgraded parts at one shot instead of ordering stuff as it breaks or if i would want to upgrade some parts down the road. I was not having any of idea that the mods didn't do that much to up the performance or justify the expense. I do understand what you are saying and that makes total sense to me now. Thanks much.